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Sleepy Shadow
Qualified Scrub
310
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Posted - 2015.04.17 06:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
That point would be very valid if, and only if, CCP had announced that it would be lowered once all the bugs had been squashed by the vets. I donGÇÖt believe they have said anything of the sort.
Having a level 4 requirement is nothing but a cash grab. Conveniently it translates to about $20 pack you can purchase to unlock trading. If CCP was only afraid of alt farmers they could have settled with rank 1 or 2. Achieving those would still take significant amount of time, especially if youGÇÖre looking at a GÇ£real farmerGÇ¥ with alts in the double digits. So you are free to farm alts as much as you like so long as you pay CCP royalties for the privilege.
And GÇ£loyalty rankGÇ¥ has absolutely nothing to do with experience. A new player who started a month ago can buy that $20 pack and start trading. So the level 4 lock does nothing to shield those poor innocent players from the cruelty of New Eden.
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Sleepy Shadow
Qualified Scrub
314
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Posted - 2015.04.18 07:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:It may be a cash grab but the point of it is to make it as difficult as possible to farm alts rather than stop it because stopping it is impossible due to the nature of clever players. Eve Online players can farm alts as well but it's an expensive proposition for them to do so because of time and subscription cost.
No amount of clever gets you past the barrier that is loyalty rank. You either play for a very long time or you buy your way there. Through normal play for a few hours a day youGÇÖre looking at about 10 points for your efforts. It may be a little more but not by much. To go from rank 0 to 1 is 1000 points alone, so about 100 days of play, every day for one character. I donGÇÖt know how many points you need to go from 1 to 2 but IGÇÖd assume at least 2000 points. So thatGÇÖs another 200 days. For someone who has an alt, a single alt, they might do this. Not to farm but to get the items that alt has. And a person with one alt can hardly be called a farmer. Rank 1 requirement is enough of a deterrent to farmers, it takes an insane amount of time to try and get that on several alts. It is also a rank achievable by new players within a reasonable time frame. Rank 4 is not, as evidenced by the players who have been playing for a few years and have yet to reach it.
Quote:As you notice, cash is an effective barrier against farming. Only the rich players would be able to pull it off and even then they would often question the point of doing so in the first place. This keeps the number of farmers and their impact on the game to a minimum.
Why would they question it? They lose absolutely nothing by dropping money on alts; they can transfer everything to their mains and start farming. If you have the money youGÇÖre CCP approved farmer. And thatGÇÖs what I find so wrong in all this. CCP doesnGÇÖt want to stop farming; they want to stop free farming. They are also denying players access to this feature if they donGÇÖt pay. I find that absolutely disgusting. And yes, reaching rank 4 without paying is as good as GÇ£no accessGÇ¥. Waiting several years is not acceptable.
If itGÇÖs true (and it makes sense if it is), that when you create alts on your main that has used AUR those alts share the loyalty rank achieved with that AUR, then my lifetime gains of LR through playing are only about 30,000 points. And if SperoGÇÖs calculations are correct that you need $20 pack with 40K AUR to reach rank 4 it means that you need about 20,000 points. I have played since March 2013, I played it almost exclusively for the longest time, I have 5MIL WP, over 3300 wins, way over 2000 hours played and yet, through playing in two years I have only achieved 10K more points than spending $20 worth of AUR would gain.
Rank 4 is simply ridiculous. It is an insult to those who have been here for years but have not reached the required rank and a massive middle finger to all new players.
Quote:As for your final statement, I agree as well. That only further emphasizes my point that there is nothing in Dust that prepares new players on how to trade safely. Many won't even realize that there are brokers to rely on for some safety in their transactions.
I find it sad that CCP took the easy way out in their rush to suck money out of players. GÇ£Trust basedGÇ¥ trading will cause issues and it is the new and the young that suffer from it. I can almost guarantee that there also wonGÇÖt be any proper introduction in-game to this feature.
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Sleepy Shadow
Qualified Scrub
314
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Posted - 2015.04.18 08:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
I would also like to add that if CCP takes preventive measures the impact of farmers can be greatly reduced.
Starter boosters GÇô all CCP has to do is change the name and mark these as non-transferrable (or rather create a new booster that is given to new players). The ones that are out there right now will run out eventually. Initially there will be a lot of them on offer but they are consumable and since the source is cut off, you cannot get more of them.
Newsletter items GÇô these items are only available if your character was created before the newsletter came out; so these are only available to old characters and only once. Creating new alts is pointless. And as those boosters above, these are consumable. After a while things settle as people cannot get these anymore.
Keys GÇô these can only be obtained by playing the game so there is nothing wrong with GÇ£farmingGÇ¥ these. You cannot get them free so it is fair game to have people trade keys. Same goes for boxes. Even with several alts you cannot obtain that many per day as you actually have to work for them. Unless the farmer is a total no-lifer who never sleeps but I doubt we have too many of those.
Warbarge components GÇô these are the only real issue with alt farms. IGÇÖd like to see them tradable (as I would never spend a single AUR on these damn things) but I can see why CCP fears it. But I seriously doubt there are that many dedicated farmers. At most people would get them every now and then from their own alt and some would sell these but I do not believe for a second that the sale of these would ever reach the biblical proportions CCP fears. But if nothing else, make these non-tradable.
Experimental weapons GÇô it takes time to get the factory and you cannot dictate what you get. So you cannot farm 50 experimental Mass Drivers, it is random what you get and to get any decent amount of anything takes so long that this is not really a viable farm. In 50 days you might have two of each weapon, not really that profitable as bulk is what farming is about.
So what is left to farm? Starting ISK has already been reduced, you cannot really profit with any of the starting suits and most sellable items are salvage. I may have overlooked several things but these are the ones I could think of now.
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Sleepy Shadow
Qualified Scrub
318
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Posted - 2015.04.18 15:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
Knightshade Belladonna wrote:Everyone here is playing/interacting with the game in some way. Loyalty can't be based just off that. I know if someone is enjoying my car as a free ride wherever we go pitching in no gas ever at all ( but loves to say where we should go and what to do), and another friend always wants to pitch in either with gas or food/drinks while figuring out what we should do..he is more loyal in my book.
ok, that was a weird comparison ..I wouldn't judge friendship loyalty that way...but I hope in some way that kinda made sense a little to some like it did at first to me.
If you offered your car as a free ride you cannot really turn around and demand money afterwards. It is mighty kind of your friend to give you money but your other friend is not in the wrong for assuming that the ride is indeed free. This analogy reflecting CCP and DUST, not really your example per say.
F2P games offer items that people wish to buy to create revenue and thatGÇÖs fine. Almost all of my AUR has gone into BPOGÇÖs as I see value in them and I want to have them. CCPGÇÖs new tactics have become more aggressive and I find that quite distasteful. Denying access to player trading from someone who has played the game for two years is incredibly rude. We need those players even if they have not financially supported CCP, without players thereGÇÖs nothing to pay for. This game is dead when people stop playing it.
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